This is my "No ACKS PCs" circle.
This is my "No ACKS PCs" circle.
I need advice from OSR types. I am running an Against the Giants: Liberation of Geoff campaign. My players run from 4th to 1st level. Last session they pulled off a very successful ambush of some hill giants and killed four of them. On their way back to the fort they are based out of, I rolled a random encounter of 8 more hill giants. I've been letting the dice fall where they may, and decided this was an ambush on anyone on the road to the fort to thwart more sorties into Geoff. The players made the right choice and just bolted, but good initiative rolls and attack rolls by the giants felled three PCs before they could gallop away.
Tonight is our next session and I'm pretty sure they are going to want to muster some troops and go after the giants. Even if they manage to round up a posse and track the giants (who I've decided are on the way back to the Steading of the Hill Giant Chief) unless they do something crazy clever they're going to get slaughtered.
A) If that happens, should I feel bad?
B) Is it a cop-out to have the giants try to capture them instead and throw them into the dungeon level of the Steading?
C) What else could happen in this situation? I'm trying hard not to railroad and let the PCs decide their next move. I don't want to shut-down or preempt their actions by routing them in a direction they didn't choose.
Do the giants have a motive for capturing them? If their only motive is to squash them into jelly, then let them do it.
ReplyDeleteIf you really feel bad (as I would), give them signals, like having members of their posse chicken out while tracking them ("This is suicide, I'm getting out of here").
Great question!
ReplyDeleteA) No need to feel bad. The players are making plans and attempting them. That's awesome. Your job isn't (necessarily) to ensure that their plan succeeds. Indeed, if you nerf it to ensure they succeed, then how will they know if their plan was a good idea?
B) Not cheating at all. Depends on the fiction; would the hill giants be smart enough to realize that these are dangerous enemies, and that a simple slugfest won't work?
C) A few options: Halfway through the encounter, the remaining hill giants surrender, run away, or otherwise back down. Or, when the players arrive, only 4 of the hill giants are there...so where are the others? Or, the hill giants have split into several groups (two patrol groups of 2 each, and the main body of 4), so the PCs are more likely to divide and conquer.
I'm going to have them make reaction rolls to muster up the troops. If they screw that up I won't need to worry about this. :) If they are successful, I like the idea of morale checks for the troops BEFORE the fight.
ReplyDeleteBrian Takle the motive for capture would be me adding a mysterious robed figure as the leader of the giants, insisting on the capture of some humans for experiments. Starting from the dungeon level of the Steading and escaping seems more level appropriate than just an assault where you're fighting dozens of giants. I was going to have an entrance to the underdark down there as well, if they want to take that route and not face the giants upstairs.
I agree with Marc Hertogh that if it's stupid, then it should be hard to round up NPCs willing to throw away their lives (at least a negative modifier on their reaction roll to sign on).
ReplyDeleteOn the other hand, I don't see a problem with the giants capturing them ... but if you go that route you should make it a thing about giants in the campaign, not just a quirk that saves the players bacon this one time. Having giants usually attempt to capture foes to ransom or save to eat later is the way your setting gets depth and gives the players a handle on planning for the future. It's is much more satisfying when later on in the campaign the players are able to reason about what probably happened to the people in the caravan that was attacked by giants based on their memory of past adventures than because the GM tells them "you remember that you once heard..." or "make a knowledge roll"
Cory D Dodt that's a good idea. I will have some options planned. I've got to look at my map and see what's on the way back to where I've got the steading. I believe I've got a haunted battlefield in there somewhere. The giants might give it a wide berth, but maybe the party can cut them off if they cross it. But it's getting dark...
ReplyDeleteHaving potential NPC hirees saying, "What, are you crazy?" (or more subtly, an obviously overconfident/braggart one saying, "Sign me up!", or some combination of these two) should be plenty of warning that the encounter is out of their league.
ReplyDeleteIn general I love bad guys who will capture PCs for various nefarious purposes including stew pots -- but it has to make sense. If the giants have been established as being the squashing type, it feels too much like an out if they decide not to squash just this once. If they haven't been established any way yet, then having a good reason to save the PCs for later could be fun.
I love the deer trail, too; that could turn into an exciting chase sequence with the giants forcing their way through the shrubbery while the PCs balance fleeing with trying to get in a few Parthian shots. It could also turn into a rescue loop if some PCs get cut off, but that's the nature of the game.
Update: The TPK was avoided, but just by dumb luck. One of the new replacement characters from last session's carnage is a bard. His Braveheart speech convinced 3 dozen mercenaries to follow the party after the giants. The giants had a big headstart though.
ReplyDeleteFirst chance to chicken out was at the haunted battlefield. The mercs wanted to turn back, but the bard kept rolling insanely high on his reaction rolls. So they took the short-cut across the battlefield and were attacked by ghouls. The ghouls dragged off 11 of their men. Again the bard reassured the men while they waited for the paralysis on those wounded to wear off.
Now they were further behind the giants, but the explorer never lost the trail. Next they found (random encounter) a bandit camp full of over 250 bandits. It was dark, and they decided to skirt the camp. They almost decided to just walk in and try to hire them. But since the giants had just passed this way, I had decided the bandits were in cahoots with the giants, so it's good they didn't.
So they went around the bandit camp, losing more time. Now they weren't going to catch the giants for the third day. Again the bard rolled insanely on his reaction roll with the mercs. Finally the next day they found the giants. And then decided to chicken out. All this tracking and big talk and they wussed out. They decided to follow from a distance and see where the giants camped. The giants made it to the Steading and when I described how huge it was, they came to their senses and just left. It took another two days march, but they made it back without incident.
And then they just asked one of the officers at the fort for an assignment, so I let them off the sandbox hook and gave them a mission.
Casey Garske That sounds absolutely delightful. What a bard!
ReplyDelete